The trucks in my department have a fog nozzle on the tip of the aerial. The solid tip that accompanies it is in the compartment. The thinking behind this is having the fog for exposure protection once on scene immediately. I can go with that. If that is the reasoning and the plan is to switch to solid tip if needed…we must follow the plan.
In the video below you will see a snorkel attacking a fully involved house fire. Needless to say that a solid tip would have been much more efficient. Don’t worry guys, everyone does it but nobody should. It only takes an extra minute or two to swap them out once on scene. The time it takes to swap them out will be worth it in putting the fire out quicker. Unknown location.
This bonus video is of a fire in Syracuse, New York. I wonder if they are planning on using a fog or solid tip? You can’t tell from the video.
Smooth bore 100%. Your apparatus should be set up for offensive fire fighting. If the decision is made to do defensive or, as you mentioned, exposure protection, let’s take a deep breath, slow down and switch out the nozzles.
If you’re running with the fog for exposure protection you are setting yourself up for delay at the scene of what will likely be an offensive firefight..
IMHO
Smooth bore 100%. Your apparatus should be set up for offensive fire fighting. If the decision is made to do defensive or, as you mentioned, exposure protection, let’s take a deep breath, slow down and switch out the nozzles.
If you’re running with the fog for exposure protection you are setting yourself up for delay at the scene of what will likely be an offensive firefight..
IMHO
HM,
I guess I kind of agree and kind of disagree. The way I see it, we are set up with fogs for exposure protection. That is an offensive attack isn’t it. Most FD’s don’t go into the house to protect it from exposure. They set up a fog on the exposure and attack the building on fire. Setting up with a solid tip would actually be setting up for a defensive attack.
I guess our guys like the fog in place for exposure. We don’t put aerials in the air to fight fire that often. We are a very aggressive department that usually goes inside. When and if we put the sticks in the air to fight fire, we SHOULD have time to swap them out. Most departments never swap them out though.
HM,
I guess I kind of agree and kind of disagree. The way I see it, we are set up with fogs for exposure protection. That is an offensive attack isn’t it. Most FD’s don’t go into the house to protect it from exposure. They set up a fog on the exposure and attack the building on fire. Setting up with a solid tip would actually be setting up for a defensive attack.
I guess our guys like the fog in place for exposure. We don’t put aerials in the air to fight fire that often. We are a very aggressive department that usually goes inside. When and if we put the sticks in the air to fight fire, we SHOULD have time to swap them out. Most departments never swap them out though.
Indeed it seems departments not putting too many “sticks up” run the fog for the reasons you mention.
I think some regional terminology may be interfering with the discussion though.
When I say offensive fire attack, I mean attacking the seat of the fire to prevent it from expanding, not to say all persons have pulled out. When the water pipes go up, the walls come down, is a common tale.
When I say defensive, I imply that the bulk of the fire building has been written off and the main mission of units on the scene is to protect exposures.
Truly the best exposure protection is to put the fire out. Spending time and resources to set up a water curtain of fog on a building not burning while that water could help put the fire out is not a tactic, but a misguided resource.
I think this argument is similar to the culture of extinguishment comments surfacing in our profession today. Forget the 2 in 2 out if 4 inside can put the fire out and eliminate the need for a rescue down the line.
But that is for a whole other post I think. Keep these issues out there!
i am happy to see that aerial ladder and his master fog stream,
this foz nuzzle flow rate is to much for this fire (house) and we cannot throw water on the roof for nothing, because we can’t extinguihs the fire under the roof. we loose time and water.
the aerial ladder smaller flow rate of water 500 gpm insted of a 1000 gpm, is all right but just on the top above the top of the house for 2 to 4 meters heigh just to absorb the heat, of the fire and the radiant heat for the neighbourhood , The heat is really reduce, the propagation stop, the gases emission is reduce and you have to plan your offensive interior attack, will be more easy to go to the seat of the fire to extinguish it,
Other possibility the ladder and is master fog (reduce the flow rate) can come closer the entry and throw direct master fog stream inside the house for a few dash, if it possible, guess the possibility and you extinguish this fire in a few minutes. try it. Or try it with a 500 usgpm and a 3 ” hose line listen this, heigher the pressure to 300 psi or more if will be very easy to hold that strean and nuzzle and not back up pressure, at heigh pressure you eliminated the back-up pressure, you can hold it with one hand, I swear to it, I affirm to you to anybody because i do it myself in front of 20 firefighters in the training school I watched them in surprise, be daring, be audacious, and do it.
i am happy to see that aerial ladder and his master fog stream,
this foz nuzzle flow rate is to much for this fire (house) and we cannot throw water on the roof for nothing, because we can’t extinguihs the fire under the roof. we loose time and water.
the aerial ladder smaller flow rate of water 500 gpm insted of a 1000 gpm, is all right but just on the top above the top of the house for 2 to 4 meters heigh just to absorb the heat, of the fire and the radiant heat for the neighbourhood , The heat is really reduce, the propagation stop, the gases emission is reduce and you have to plan your offensive interior attack, will be more easy to go to the seat of the fire to extinguish it,
Other possibility the ladder and is master fog (reduce the flow rate) can come closer the entry and throw direct master fog stream inside the house for a few dash, if it possible, guess the possibility and you extinguish this fire in a few minutes. try it. Or try it with a 500 usgpm and a 3 ” hose line listen this, heigher the pressure to 300 psi or more if will be very easy to hold that strean and nuzzle and not back up pressure, at heigh pressure you eliminated the back-up pressure, you can hold it with one hand, I swear to it, I affirm to you to anybody because i do it myself in front of 20 firefighters in the training school I watched them in surprise, be daring, be audacious, and do it.
Indeed it seems departments not putting too many “sticks up” run the fog for the reasons you mention.
I think some regional terminology may be interfering with the discussion though.
When I say offensive fire attack, I mean attacking the seat of the fire to prevent it from expanding, not to say all persons have pulled out. When the water pipes go up, the walls come down, is a common tale.
When I say defensive, I imply that the bulk of the fire building has been written off and the main mission of units on the scene is to protect exposures.
Truly the best exposure protection is to put the fire out. Spending time and resources to set up a water curtain of fog on a building not burning while that water could help put the fire out is not a tactic, but a misguided resource.
I think this argument is similar to the culture of extinguishment comments surfacing in our profession today. Forget the 2 in 2 out if 4 inside can put the fire out and eliminate the need for a rescue down the line.
But that is for a whole other post I think. Keep these issues out there!